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This is Irene Ru interviewing Esther Gonzalez. At 1936 summit. In Kansas City, Missouri on July 27th, 1981. Esther Gonzalez is a regional civil rights and equal opportunity manager for the Social Security Administration. Here in Kansas City, Missouri. This is tape A. Ms. Gonzalez, will you give

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me some early information about your early life, like, you know, where you were born and when? OK. I was born in Kansas City, Kansas, and I grew up in Argentine, Kansas. Um, I was born in 1943. And I went to grade school at Saint John the

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Divine and the high school at Bishop Ward High School. OK, now what about your parents' names? Give me a little information. OK, my father's name was Ramon Gonzalez, and he was born in Mesquital Deloros, Zacatecas. My mother's name is in Mexico. My mother's name is Enriqueta.

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Her maiden name was Vega, and she was born in Corpus Christi, Texas. And about how many youngsters were in the family? How many sisters or brothers? Uh, total of 74 sisters and 3 brothers. Did you live at the same, stay at the same location for a

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number of years, or what are your earliest recollections of one location or maybe two? I can recall we lived in the same house until I was about 17 years old. OK, this would have been in the Argentine district. That's correct. OK, you would have been too,

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too young to remember much about the war unless you heard your family or somebody talking about, say, World War II, how it might have affected them or relatives. Did you have any? just a vague recollection in that my oldest brother served in the Navy, uh, but

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other than that, I really don't know. OK, but what about the community there? As, as you look back, do you remember how it stands out in your mind? I mean, the types of houses or how the people made their living and so forth? Well, for the

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most part, the, uh, The people made their living uh from the Santa Fe from the railroad and that's what brought them they were employed by the Santa Fe Railroad and that's primarily what brought the uh the community to that area because the Santa Fe Railroad was

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so close. How did your father make his living? Did he work, he, um, he came to the United States laying tracks all the way across, you know, from, uh, California to New Mexico and somehow ended up in Kansas City. You don't, you don't know just why

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it was that he settled here and you said your mother was born in Corpus Christi. Did he, did they marry down there or up here? No, my mother came up to, uh, Kansas City because her sister married someone here and my mother came up to live

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with her and then met my father, so they met here actually. Do you remember anything about the community as far as, you know, the streets or the was it mostly residential or were there little shops or stores mixed up in the area? Was it a real

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kind of a real old type neighborhood where people were very close, you know, how they went to the corner grocery store, that type of thing? Uh-huh, that's about how it was, uh, of course our house is no longer there because of urban renewal and neither is

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the store that was on the corner which was most recently known as. Uh, the Carmen Martinez, I believe the Martinez, uh, grocery store on the corner, uh, the grade school that I went to is no longer there. It, it's the building is there, but Saint John

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the Divine has, has been closed, and, uh, it was very, very, yeah, in answer to your question is very, very closely knit, uh, block, you know, like kids were out till 9 o'clock at night playing kick the can and that kind of thing all together. Were

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there any organized activities or, or you say. Did they or you attend a say a center or was there a place where you all could go for recreation as youngsters? I don't mean, you know, as, as with your family, but children are are mostly played out

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in the street or other than what I remember the nuns having at Saint John the Divine every now and then. Uh, no, I don't really recall any organized activities. I know my early, you talked about my earliest recollections, uh, when I was really, really little, like

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3 or 4 years old, I remember they used to have up until that time they still had jamaicas in the street out in Argentina all related to the church. This would be like the fiestas that we talk about. But Argentina hasn't had those for years. They're

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starting to have some again, but not like in the old days discontinued, right? OK, so you were very little for, you know, something that would have affected the, the whole, not only your immediate neighborhood, but say a great many people like the war would have affected

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the whole country. And then something else happened in 1951, which of course you were. Fairly little but you probably remember something about how it again how it affected your immediate family and others. What do what do you recall of that or well, the, the best word

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I can think of describing that whole experience was devastating. It was very, very devastating and that, um, we number one did not really or my parents. Parents did not really recognize the impact that that flood was gonna have and so to this day we all regret

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that we were not prepared for that because we lost a whole lot of family photos and a whole lot of us, you know, things that memento that meant a lot to us and that we just thought it was gonna go up to the first floor at

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that we had a two story house, so we put everything in the attic and so and of course I needless to say everything was covered even the chimney, but um. Yeah, I had quite a bit of, you know, a great impact on the community. And what

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are, what are some of your memories, say of the elementary school? Did you speak Spanish at home? Oh, what I remember about the elementary, uh, school makeup is that early on I knew that things were all not right with society in that for two reasons. Number

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one, there was another Catholic school within 5 blocks, and I could never understand why the school I went to was smaller. Number 1 was all Hispanic but was smaller, had no gym, had no cafeteria, had no facilities, and yet still the Catholic school five blocks away

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that was all Anglo had all of these facilities. I just never understood that. Yes, it was a school that. Was open about the time I started going to first grade. It had just been opened, whereas the other Anglo, uh, Catholic school grade school had been there

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for a number of years, but for some reason it just could not accommodate us because up to that time the Mexican American students had been going to the public school. And that's where I ran into problems in my kindergarten, uh, year. I went to the public

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school and I could not speak English because we just spoke Spanish at home and, uh, I recall having a minor accident. I don't know if I can say this on tape, but I didn't know how to say I had to go to the powder room and

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so I had to be taken home to, you know, have my clothes changed, but at any rate, uh, because you did not know how to say it and you were afraid to, you're right. So, so some of that was not too happy an experience then for

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you that the elementary grades. You finished there and then went on to where to the 6th bishop ward went up to the 8th grade. The Catholic school went up to 8th grade. And then you went on to bishop ward. What about in the high school then?

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Did you have better Experiences there were you active in, you know, not only your classes but in other activities like clubs and newspaper or did you take part in in um in high school, um, I was the PEPFA president and I was president of the Girls

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Athletic Association and I was a majorette. I was in band, um, and I think a whole lot of this was because my parents didn't let me date so I had to have some kind of. Extracurricular outlet, right, extracurricular activities. Um-hum. So they were very strict. Were

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they active in the Catholic Church, or belong? No, not at all. And that's another story, but no, not at all. No, but they were not active. They're Catholic, but they were not active Catholic, but they were not active. Well, some people have too much to do.

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And your mother did not work outside the home? No. Did she? She didn't. OK, did you, um. Since you were active in the, uh, what was it, the girls athletic thing, so you, you must have been good in, in sports. What in particular or several well,

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at Saint John the Divine we had a, uh, both volleyball and basketball, uh, league, and we took all kinds of first place trophies in volleyball, and we did fairly well in basketball, um, and so I try to keep up with that as, as long as I

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could in high school. I also made the National Honor Society at, uh, at Ward, and I received a. Scholarship from the American GI Forum which I did not take advantage of unfortunately, yeah. You didn't start at all. No, I've had some night school. But as far

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as scholarship, so directly did you go into a job or did you, what did you do I went immediately into working for Social Security right after high school and I've been there since. Did you, what year would this have been 1961 61 is my 20th anniversary.

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Mhm, didn't seem like. Uh, did you, uh, take, take a civil service test or what was it you in high school, uh, we had the civil service commission come into our typing and shorthand classes and administer the test, and I just kind of took it on

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a whim because I just knew I was going on to college the, uh, following, uh, fall, and so I made a fairly decent passing grade on it and next thing I knew I was being offered all this money, $3700 at the time. This seemed like so

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much money. You know, in 1961, so for some other unmitigated circumstances, I went on ahead and took the job instead of going to school. Had you planned on any career in particular, or you, or did you just, you just knew you just wanted to go to

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college, right? I thought eventually I would either get married or go back into college full time, which I didn't. Were you encouraged at home? I mean, say like your mother or your dad or sisters or anybody, would you say, or, or was this something just in

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your own? What I'm trying to get is, was there somebody who. Well that's encourage you, you know, the academic roots. Well, on my father's part, and may he rest in peace, and I love him dearly, but he, uh, took on the role of the, um, how

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can I say, very patriarchal in that he thought that I should stay home even he didn't even encourage high school from grade school. What more education than I need. Meeting with many of the of the Mexican American, well, his thinking was why did I need a

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high school, much less a college degree to wash diapers and cook and stay at home, but keep in mind that, you know, my father was not educated at all and I thought did very, very well coming to this, you know, country and doing what he did.

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So it's just I understand where, as they say in the vernacular, where he was coming from. Well then, would you credit anybody else, uh. Maybe a counselor or friends, I mean outside of say your mother or some other relative who may have encouraged you, was there

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any our teacher or yeah, I would say if there was someone to credit it would probably be my the nun that that taught us in 7th and 8th grade who, who encourageencouraged, yeah, uh-huh, encouraged us and, and told us how important it was to get our

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education and, you know, to make something of ourselves. Of course at the time she's trying to talk all of the young ladies into becoming nuns. I thought you were just saying go on to school, go on to college. Recruiting systems. OK, and so then you said

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you immediately went to work for Social Security and so this would have been like a clerk or a typist or secretary had you had uh. Some clerical stenographic work and no, all I had was a, uh, typing and shorthand that I had in school, in high

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school. Have, have you always worked here in Kansas City then with Social Security or no you moved transferred elsewhere? Yes, I, uh, went on ahead and took a, uh, transfer to Denver, Colorado for a promotion. And uh I got a couple of promotions out there and

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then decided to come back home. What year would this have been that you stayed in Kansas City for a few years and then took the transfer. Oh, it was probably like in 1967 to about 1970, 1971 came back. Thank you. And then you've remained here ever

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since. And then you've, you've been promoted and this last promotion where you became regional civil rights. The central manager was when, how recent or how long ago were you promoted to that? I was promoted to that in about 1976, although, uh, the title has just been

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changed at that time. I was promoted to an EEO officer and so with the, uh, I guess you would call it the advent of civil rights to Social Security beneficiaries, they added another promotion to it and a a different title to it, but it's basically the

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same job. And somewhere along the way you get married too. Would you like to say a little something? I know that you use your, your name, which is your privilege to use your maiden name, but I know that we were talking earlier and how did this

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come about or where did you meet your husband? Well, first of all, I use my original name Gonzalez. Uh, I know a lot of people refer to. It has your maiden name and it's original name as well as maiden and uh I met my husband in

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uh well he's from Topeka Kansas and coincidentally enough his grand one side well the paternal grandparents are also from Zacatecas and that's where my father is from. And his both his grandfather and his father worked for San Santa Fe for the railroad as like my father,

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but you didn't know him way back there. No, I met him later and, uh, then, uh, we met here in Kansas City and got married, uh, almost 6 years ago, 1975 in Kansas City, Missouri, and we were married by Father Ramon Gayetan, who was here earlier.

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And um. Somewhere along the way with all this uh activities that you've been involved in, have you received some recognition or citations or awards? Um, I have received a federal executive board, uh, Equal Opportunity Award for, I believe it was in 1979. Um, I, do you

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know, I cannot really recall right now what I've received, what you received. Well, what, uh, what I know you're active with some organizations, maybe it'll come to you a little bit later, but would you mention. You know some of the organizations that you are active with,

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well, currently I'm, I'm, and have been not just currently I have been involved with Image, uh, since the first chapter was formed in Denver, Colorado in about 1970, and, uh, I was at the time working, uh, with the chapter there and in fact even came in

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when we were deciding what to name image and it was funny how we went through all the different, you know, uh, acronyms and for the. record you might clarify I know that at one time it meant incorporated Mexican American government employees, but now of course you

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retain the title but it includes Hispanics and other non-Hispanics, but that was originally the intent wasn't it? Right? It includes, uh, it's been extended to include all Hispanics, Puerto Ricans, Cubans, South Americans, etc. as well as, as you say, uh, committed and interested people that are

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non-Hispanic and um have you held some. Um, Position that is uh officer or executive position that yes throughout the years I've belonged here not only in Denver but when I came here I joined the the uh the chapter here when it was first formed and at

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the time I think I've held positions ranging from secretary to treasurer and 2nd vice president and I'm currently the 1st vice president, which means you may be president before very long. And uh I unofficially am am now the regional Women's Action Committee representative for uh Image

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and I'm following Becky's footsteps. Becky Jaramil's footsteps, and I'm sure you will agree that those are some pretty big shoes to fill. And uh have you been active with some other organization too, or which others you might mention here? Well, I would say, uh, to, to,

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I belong to several, but I would say the only other one that I have been somewhat active in has been the federal federally employed women's organization, and, uh, but I'm not currently a member of that organization. Are you active in anything else? No, I'm not. And

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and then you mentioned too along the way you've been you've taken some courses. I know you're fairly busy and I suppose in your job you do travel, don't you too? So how were you able to manage? You took some night classes where did you attend? Um,

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I went to, uh, both UMKC and Johnson County Community College, uh, and you're right, it isn't very easy. I really, really admire women that are working, have children and husbands and house to keep up and all they can do that. What does your husband do? Does

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he work for the government? Yes, uh-huh. I think I failed to mention this earlier. My husband's name is Ron Borgian or Borjon, B O R J O N. Uh-huh. What's your first name? Ron or Reynaldo Reyes Borjon, but we call him J O N. Uh-huh. I

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see. Yes, he works at the post office for the postal inspection. So he's generally based here and you're the one that traveled. Uh, as you look ahead then, what are some of the other, um, goals or Aspirations that you might have for your own, you know,

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personal life or for position or whatever organizations, what are some of the things you would like to accomplish or see accomplished? Well, I think one of the things, uh, personally one of my. Priorities would be to uh to complete my college education somewhere or another people

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have mentioned that to me. Why do you feel such a need when you've already, you know, you retained some degree of success and all, but I think that it's something no one can ever take away from you, the knowledge in your up here in your head,

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um, what would I like to see, of course I'm very idealistic and hopefully someday we will, you know, see equality for everybody and. Uh, that we'll see parity as far as you know, be able to reach parity and employment, you know, as well as education and

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housing, etc. but I know that's very, very, I don't know if I could play a very minute role in that, but, um. But in your more uh maybe not as broad but you closer to you than you would like to say go on and get some

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kind of degree right and uh any other thing well maybe someday I, uh, as much as I love civil rights and equal opportunity work I might uh consider getting into some other type of managerial position at Social Security. Is there anything else then that you would

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like to And no, again, I really appreciated you, uh, having me here today. Uh-huh. Well, you certainly hold one of the highest positions in that field, especially we don't like to say women, but certainly we know that in the past women were not usually able to

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attain such things. So we certainly hope that you'll be successful and achieve. Degree or whatever else and maybe I can be a role model to somebody else coming up that's what it's all about is that I think what we're working for is to uh when we're

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no longer here to be replaced by someone in another Hispanic as well as a woman but certainly a Hispanic would be ideal. All right, I certainly want to thank you for this interview, and this concludes this part of the interview. Thank you.