00:00:01.299 - 00:00:32.540

2345. This is April 12th, 1976. I am Ella Pruitt. I am interviewing Mr. Henry Warren Sing. Of Douglas State Bank. I am interviewing him at the Douglas State Bank. Mr. Sewing, we're going to begin the interview with your early childhood. Would you tell me when and

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where you were born? I was born in Bremond, B R E M O N D, Texas. The date? Yes, the date. February 15th, 1891. OK, tell me as much as you can about your parents, who they were, their names, and, uh, possibly their occupations. What did

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they do? My parents was Thomas Restless Sowing. And Margaret saw. They are. My father did common labor. And my wife and my mother was a washwoman. How many children were in your family? There were 6. OK. And, uh, according to your book, I see that. Just

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a minute. Uh, I, I'm not taking those that passed. Uh-huh. See, let's see. No, actually, Uh, actually a tool, let me see that. Uh, uh, So. And, uh, That's 5, you know. I mean, it's not 5, you know, but that, that was, uh, That was 8

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of us. OK. OK, Mr. Soyn, I'm aware that your parents were very active in church. Can you recall the name of the church? Yes, Progress Baptist Church of Fremont, Texas. Could you describe the church? Was it a small church? Very small, very small. To begin with,

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it started as a, just an ordinary journey. And uh finally we, we built a church, but it was a very, very small church that would accommodate I would say about 100 people. I see. Your father, was he active in church? Very much so. In what capacity

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he was a deacon. A deacon. Yeah, I might say a head deacon. He had a great deal to do with the running of the church. OK. What about you as a child in the church? Well, I grew up as a Sunday school pupil. That's about all

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that I can say. Were you baptized? Yes, I was at the age of 9. At the age of 9. OK. Did the church at that time, you know, now the church has different activities for the youth, uh, such as in the summer school they may have

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vacation Bible school. During these days, uh, during those days, excuse me, did they have any type of programs such as this. It was just basically what you just went to church Sunday school. And DYPU meeting. OK, what about during the week now, that's, that's usually on

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Sunday. Prayer meeting on Wednesday night. Prayer meeting. Approximately how long did that last for prayer meetings, maybe. What do you mean? How long did the prayer meetings last on Wednesday night? Oh, they last, I guess, about an hour to an hour and a half. OK. I

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also, uh, looking back at your book, you recall picking cotton. Yeah, so, yeah. Now, was this picking cotton so to help the family? Why did you pick, what, what reason? Well, it, it was just, uh, an industry, the cotton, cotton would have big industry in in

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Texas. I see. And, uh, of course, in the fall of VF, we went off on these what are called cotton picks. And, uh, it lasted about a couple of months, about a couple of months to get your money in for Christmas and other things that are

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necessary to buy. I see. OK, now, um, the struggle for for an education. Why did you consider education at that time to be a struggle? Were the circumstances within the family maybe as you had to To slow down and help more with the family. Well, I'll

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tell you, My schooling. Began at the age of 9. And uh the system provided for only 9 grades of work. You graduated at the 9th grade. Uh, as a matter of fact, the, the period, the school period was very short, about 54 to 5 months in

00:05:05.309 - 00:05:27.820

the year. And I, uh, I went to school, um, until I got to the 6th grade. And I self-taught myself until I went to Boyd Academy in East Texas. When I left, when I left public school, I was in the 6th grade. I began at the

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age of 9, as I said, and uh, when I went to Boyd Academy, I entered the 9th grade. And graduated from the nominal course in three years. OK, now, I don't, what do you mean by, uh, nominal course? I've never heard of that. Well, no, You

00:05:45.260 - 00:06:05.779

have what is known as a high school graduate, but in those kinds of schools, uh, they wouldn't say you graduated from the high school, they say you graduated from the normal course that involved 12 years. But it's equal to the gra graduation in the other schools.

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OK. Now from this time, what did you do next after you graduated? I stayed out of school one year. Uh, trying to find work to do to save money to go go to Harvard University. But, uh, I didn't, and I took an examination. I didn't pass

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the examination. And so I did the next best thing. I went to Tillerson College. I didn't have any money. I went there as a white student. OK, what type of work was available to you at that time? As a matter of fact, it might seem funny,

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but most of that work was a student teacher. Oh yeah. I was a student teacher at uh at uh Tillerson College And when I left Tillerson College and went to Sisk University, I was a student, I was a teacher there. When I, when I arrived on

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the campus of Sisk University. I ended there with 25 cents. That's all the money that I had. Now, this, uh, as you were leaving Tillerson, this is where you first met your wife, right? Oh, yes. Would you tell me about your wife? Well, How did you

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meet her? Was she on campus? Yes, I have that. At, um, Bard Academy. I became acquainted with the nice young girl that we started going together. But, uh, our courtship didn't last very long, last couple of years, I would say. Uh, she thought that I was

00:07:51.820 - 00:08:07.029

going with some other girl, which I was not. My sister kind of conspired with that other girl to try to Do all the help that you could and breaking up the Ethel and my set, but you didn't do it. But we got little cold toward each

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other. I, we, we maintained friendship, however. Now her name was Ethel Black. Ethel Black. Right, OK. We maintained a friendship with each other. And um the first year that I went to Tillerson College, that that was in 1911 and leaving uh after after the commencement we

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left on a train on our way home and Ina Wideman was one of the uh students that was on that, that, uh, train at that particular time. She was, I would say that she was 16 years of age. And, uh, she was the only girl that

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I've sent a postcard to. I, I didn't have anything else in mind. She seemed to be just a nice chap. And so, when she came back the next year, it so happened, That, uh, she sat at my table at the head table, you know, had, had

00:09:02.260 - 00:09:17.750

for. And, uh, the other girls that, before she came, all of the other girls were my play daughters, and I had one, a baby daughter. And when she came, I said, well, I'll make you a baby daughter, and the kids began to tease her about it.

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So she wrote me a little note and said, possibly it's best for you not to call me a baby daughter because it's caused a confusion. And I just smiled and shook my head. Well, at this, at this particular time that I'm speaking, she was, she was.

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7. 17 years of age. And so I was not going to anybody. So when we had our supper and parties but I didn't go out with her. I continued to go to see Ethel, and whenever I, she lived in Austin, Texas, also where the school was.

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I, I continued to go there and when I'd go back, I'd say, well, I said, I saw Ethel today, and she said, did you have a nice time? I said yes, I'm glad you did. Well, that kind of a thing, uh, continued for about 6 months.

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And she never did assume any other relationship other than just a baby daughter. So I began to think about her and I said, this girl looks all right to me, and I spoke to her about going with her, you know, and she said, well, I'll think

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about it. She never did say anything else except I'll think about it and we just started going. So from then on, we just went together regularly and as I said, for a total of 4.5 years. And we never had a hard voyage to passed between us

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during that entire period of four years. So, uh, in 1915, I, uh, in May of 1915, I graduated, graduated from Tillerson College with an AP, uh, uh, uh, diploma. And then I went in the, in the fall of that year I went to Fisk University. Now

00:11:01.580 - 00:11:18.549

you had some problems at Fisk, right? What kind of problems? I don't know. Uh, I'm, uh, like monetary problems as far as having enough money. Oh, I didn't have any money. Didn't have any. How did, now tell me how you managed to survive at Fisk. Do

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you know? Well, I had written the president of Fisher University, And I had informed him that while at uh Tillerson College. I had done some student work, student teaching, and also a monitor of the of the reading room and so forth and uh I, I wanted

00:11:40.690 - 00:11:54.859

them to provide me sufficient breaks so I could go to school there. And somehow or another they let me come home, but they thought they were going to have some money. And as I said, when I got on the counter, I had 25 cents left. Well,

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they gave me, at that time, uh, Fisher had a high school department too. And they gave me, uh, classes in, in, uh, arithmetic. And No, I take it back algebra and geometry. And uh I had, uh, I had two classes in, in each of those branches

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of study. And then I kept the, uh, telephone office at night on any calls that came in. I, uh, I took them, And uh I was having a little hard time and I thought I'd try going out as a non-boarding student and getting a job in

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the meantime, but I wasn't able to find it, so uh I came on back as a boarding student. And, uh, this, this one little thing that I'm about to say, I've always been proud of myself because I thought about it. Uh, I, uh, they, they allowed

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me, um, salary, I guess they call them salary. And uh so when I got ready to, when I graduated. And I'm getting ahead of my story. That's OK. I didn't know just how I get back home. I went down to stay, uh, two years, but my

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father was having no difficulty in paying for his place, and I know, I thought I'd better go out and help him. So, um, I didn't have any money. I didn't know how in the world I was going to get home and, and in the midst of

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this situation. I went to the office to clear my situation up to see whether I owed anything and Because I know you don't owe anything and, uh, you have, uh, $43.25 coming. And I said, no, I don't think you're right. She said, yes, you have it,

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you have it. And we talked about it, and so I said, well, I'll tell you what I'll do. I'll, I'll, I'll take this money. And go to my room, down to the room. And see, can I figure out not just what had happened. What I found

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out, Uh, when I went back at the Fish, I haven't gone out to get a job and extra money. I came back in January the first, and she had me recorded as me coming back in February the first, and I called her attention to that. And

00:14:32.409 - 00:14:53.049

uh she said, well you're wrong, you came back in February and you ought to be glad that it is like it is. I said, well, I'll tell you what I'm going to do. I'm going to leave this $43.65 here. And I'll go study it again, and

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if I find that I'm wrong, I'll come for it, otherwise I'll leave it here. Now, I didn't go back at it. Now, I'm proud of myself at that point in my life. You should be. I was as poor as they came. I borrowed from, uh, a

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doctor, he's a doctor now, a dentist. Cummings and I saw him, uh, I was at a banker's convention about a couple of years ago and I saw him. I borrowed, uh, $15 from him. Uh, uh, $10 from another fellow. Um-hum. And, uh, and, uh, and $10

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from, you know, And that's the way I got money to go back home after graduating. Now, I had decided, I think this ought to be interesting too. I had decided that in going back home, I wouldn't go straight home, I'd go to, uh, Dallas, Texas, where

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I meet a friend of mine and stay with him and try to get a job there. Alright, so, um, I stopped there with the firm intention. Of, uh, staying over there and trying to find some way, but somehow or another I got to feel that I

00:16:07.909 - 00:16:25.210

ought to go home, go straight home. So I caught the train that night and went home, went to bed, and before I could get up that morning, I received a telegram from a professor Anderson, who was principal of the high school in Austin, Texas, and telling

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me to come on down to Dallas and they have a job for me. What type of job was it, a teaching job? Teaching job. Yeah, a teaching job. What subjects were you going to teach then? Do you recall? Was it I was going to teach whatever

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subjects they had. That's right. But I went to an elementary school, see, and I think I had kids in the 6th grade, see, and I, I, I, I spent Part of the year at the school in what they call South Austin, and then they changed from

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that to a school that uh Uh, they, they call it the Gregory, Gregantown School. Let me stop you right right here just for a minute. I'd like to make a quote from your book. I found out that a Negro school teacher with the same educational background

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and qualifications as a white teacher was paid only half the salary. Yeah, because one is colored and one they made no bones about it. That's the way the system works. And this was in Texas. Yeah, in Austin, Texas. Austin, Texas. That was the way that the

00:17:40.109 - 00:18:00.400

system worked. And I understand it worked that way in many places in the South. And I took, uh, pedagogy in school. Uh, that, uh, thought I'd get a number of chips on teaching because I didn't see any else, anything else to do except go the school

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room, But that was one point that I never did see. And let it go. When I went to, I went to graduate school, that's kind of tough school. And, uh, one of the kids was cutting up. Is it a boy or a girl? Boy boy. I

00:18:19.000 - 00:18:35.729

got after him. He went to, he invited me outdoors for a fight. Oh. I went, I went to the, I went to the principal. I told him what the boy had done. I said, what shall I do? He said, get him, go get him. So I

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had to go get him. What did the boy think of that? Did he come? Did he just come on? Did he willingly come. Oh, I got over to him and brought him on. And brought him on in. Yeah, yeah, and brought him on in. And, uh,

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I didn't, I didn't get that in school. No. A number of things, a number of things that I experienced in teaching wasn't in the book at all. So, so I taught there for the rest of that year. And then the following year, I went to Anderson

00:19:03.339 - 00:19:25.939

High School. And I taught, uh, two things that have no possible relationship, but I had a place in, uh, Latin, Latin, and also mathematics. I was taught mathematics and Latin at, uh, at Anderson High School. I was taught that for 3 years. OK. And, uh, I

00:19:25.939 - 00:19:48.439

liked Austin, Texas very well. I had a friend who was teaching there and we had a nice friendship together. And but in the meantime. I took a correspondence course and, uh. Can you recall, uh, Mr. uh Son about how much was the uh for college credit

00:19:48.439 - 00:20:02.089

thing? You know, now it's up to some places $42 an hour. You. Oh, they, they didn't, they didn't know, they, they, they don't, we didn't know anything like that. Oh. That, that, uh, that wasn't part of the system at all. We just, they get to got

00:20:02.089 - 00:20:23.510

church as cheap as they could. Hmm. Now, I started, I started with $45 a month. Um-hum. In the elementary school, and then they changed, then the first promotion was to $50 a month. Well, when I left the high school, it had gone up to $75 per

00:20:23.510 - 00:20:45.989

month. Now, as I said, I took, uh, I took, um, a, Uh, with my correspondence with La Salle Extension University of Chicago. I don't know why I took that, except, uh, I was thinking that, uh, maybe I could break into some high, uh, uh, degree of

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weight. And uh but I was satisfied with Austin. I was buying a new home. I guess that's all that's in the book. I was buying a home. My wife liked it and so forth. And the street, I walked down the street with a friend. Led to

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changing all of that. I said to this man Fra said, are you going to spend the, the, the summer in Austin, Texas? He says, no, I, as a matter of fact, I don't intend to stay here. And he told me some uh good opportunity he had

00:21:16.680 - 00:21:32.439

to get out of the way, but he didn't go, that, that didn't work out, but said, I'm not going to stay here. And I said to him, I said, I wouldn't mind, Leaving Austin, Texas, or those kind of situations would come up to me. He said

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they won't come up to you, you have to go after them. OK. And I thought about that, and I thought about that, and I thought about that. I prayed about it. And, uh, discussed it with my wife and discussed it with my school principal and my

00:21:47.609 - 00:22:04.109

other friends, and finally I made up my mind that I wouldn't say that. And I tore up the application to teach another year, contract rather, teach another year. And I did that because I felt that the going might get hard for me and if I had

00:22:04.109 - 00:22:20.270

signed a contract, I'd go back. My principal told me, so, so I sign up and go in if you get a good situation that day you don't just resign. But no, I didn't want any bridges to be left for me to come back over there. So

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I, I came home to, uh, went to Chicago. And I look for a job all day long. But I saw that Chicago wasn't the place for me. And I, uh, I left that night. I borrowed $10 from a, a cousin of mine. I realized that if

00:22:42.670 - 00:22:58.099

I stayed there another, uh, day, I wouldn't have money to get out of town. So, I borrowed 10 from him, and he suggested that I stop at the YMCA in, uh, uh, here in Kansas City. Didn't know a single person in here. So, this is your

00:22:58.099 - 00:23:19.640

first coming to Kansas City. Yeah. On the way from Chicago. Um-hum. OK. Yeah. And, um, so I, I came down, I started, I stopped one night at the Y and I met some people there from Texas, and, uh, I got a room with those people. And

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I wasn't that day, about two days, I would say, before somebody had stolen all of my clothes. Well, that put, put a big blow to me. And I remember one day I sat up in the window. And I said to myself, what a fool I've been.

00:23:39.489 - 00:23:59.339

Tearing up that good contract, uh, the contract, and here I am at that particular time, I was working at the freight house. Uh, you know, you know what they they comment on that. But I, uh, got, uh, kind of perked up a little bit. I said,

00:23:59.380 - 00:24:18.969

well, maybe I can get something else. And one day I saw a little ad in the paper said, a stock room. 20 color. Well, I got permission from the timekeeper to go attend some Benard, and I went there and And, and there were several other people

00:24:18.969 - 00:24:41.430

there at the time. And he asked me what I, what I had been doing in the past. I said I, I was a teacher of Latin. Uh, and mathematics. And he said, well, I'll tell you one thing. It's a world of difference between this jar. And

00:24:41.430 - 00:24:58.560

the job as a teacher of Latin and mathematics. My answer was yes, I, I realize what you said, but the same fundamental principle that would make a person a good Latin teacher would make him a good, good on this job. And so he said, well, you

00:24:58.560 - 00:25:13.479

can call me, and then I said, he said, I have dozens of people coming in here, but you can call me and I'll let you know. And I left and got the job. So when evening came, I had a debate with myself. As to whether to

00:25:13.479 - 00:25:32.890

stop, uh, I should stop by, because I said somebody in the meantime would be hiring and no you and me. And the reason why I was debating, if I stopped by my contract would run, my, my, my, Uh, my, uh, I had a, you know, you,

00:25:33.010 - 00:25:50.449

you get a pen and then they give you one of these, uh, slips, you know. Yes. And I said, uh, my pass, Would run out, and that'd cost me another nickel to get home. Um-hum. And I, I kind of halfway thought I couldn't afford to take

00:25:50.449 - 00:26:07.099

a loss on that nickel. But I said, well, I'll go now. So, I stopped by. Somebody was being interviewed at that time. And, uh, when he got through, he said, well, I've decided on another fellow and says, uh, you can call in a couple of weeks

00:26:07.099 - 00:26:19.500

and if he doesn't succeed, then I'll talk to you again. And they said, come up soon. I knew I had the job when he called my name, said come up soon. Um-hum. And he said, fellows have been coming in all day here, but you said something

00:26:19.500 - 00:26:40.969

to me this morning that stayed with me all day long and I'm going to give you the job. They gave me a job. And, uh, after I worked there for 6 weeks, I became very dissatisfied. And were you satisfied with the pay, what was it? $15

00:26:40.969 - 00:26:54.170

a week. $15 a week. That's pretty good. That's pretty good right there, yeah. Uh, and, uh, and, uh, so, my, I got the job, and it like that. And I went to see him and told him that I liked the job all right, but I, I

00:26:54.170 - 00:27:06.770

had a wife and a child and I couldn't get along well I was 15. He said, well, I'll think about it. Now, were, uh, your, your family. We. Were they here in Kansas City at that time? No. They were still in? No, no, not in Austin.

00:27:07.099 - 00:27:20.479

She, I sent her her home, her, her and the child home to wait until I could send for them. Oh, OK. In Cameron, Texas. Cameron, Texas. OK. So, any, anyhow, um, he said, I'll think about it. Now, I was on, uh, so far as the clerks

00:27:20.479 - 00:27:35.819

are concerned, I was on black clerks, the others were white. And, and, and they came and I got ready to go. He said, come up. He said I've done, uh, well as I could for him. He increased my pay by 3 from 15 to 18. To

00:27:35.819 - 00:27:51.540

18, uh-huh. He said, but don't say anything to the other fellows about it because they'll get jealous, he said. And I think that's right. And I worked and finally I got the discussed and I said, I'm going to get me another job. I talked to the

00:27:51.540 - 00:28:10.479

superintendent of the schools here. I talked to the principal of the high school. Who was the superintendent at that time? Uh, Mr, Always have said, tell her that I just performed when Professor Slager. Pearson. Yeah, Pearson Pearson. Pearson, Pearson, I taught there. And, uh, so, uh,

00:28:10.810 - 00:28:38.890

and finally, I went to Western University and taught there, and I got a job there. They, they hired me immediately. And, uh, I stayed there for, 3 years. And I resigned there to, uh, to take up life insurance, life insurance, salesmanship. And uh after working there

00:28:38.890 - 00:29:04.119

first as a part-timer, as a full-timer, I was there for like a year um and I wouldn't, I don't mean that, yes, I was not quite a year, however, uh, I was sent to school of agency supervision at Atlanta, Georgia. Uh, and that was in 1923,

00:29:04.239 - 00:30:34.260

I believe, the fall of 1923. And then, uh, that following December, I made, uh, Uh, manager of the Kansas City agency. And, uh, I stayed there until the company went broke. OK. I'm talking about is, uh, 1917. And, uh, I believe it's 17, I'm

00:30:34.260 - 00:30:54.650

pretty sure it was because I was drafted in 1918, 1917, and several of my friends left to attend the attend the army school. A good friend of mine, would it, would it be Cameron of Austin, Texas, son of a very prominent in medicine, who subsequently became

00:30:54.650 - 00:31:18.520

principal of Anderson High School. And that was, uh, for, uh, I was up on all of those that went, but I didn't go. I didn't apply because, number one, there had been a riot. Uh, uh, of soldiers in Kansas City, not Kansas City, in, in Houston,

00:31:18.640 - 00:31:38.280

Texas. And uh. They, as a matter of fact, they prosecute those fellows and so uh kill a number of them. And uh I felt that it was so wrong for them to be protecting the life of a colored woman and all of them get killed that

00:31:38.280 - 00:32:02.130

way. Uh, that was in Houston, Texas at that time, and I was just bitter against going to the army and I didn't go, but I was drafted, uh, September the first. Uh, 1918. I was drafted. And, uh, I went to Des Moines, Iowa. And I stayed

00:32:02.130 - 00:32:23.890

there 3 months. And, and, and, and I never carried a gun on my shoulder during the entire time that I was there. And my wake was confined my awake was confined to the in the office of the office and or the the offices of. And, uh,

00:32:23.900 - 00:32:44.160

on the, never forget that day, November 18th, when I was discharged and went back home, OK. OK. So that wraps up that problem. Now, um, after getting settled in Kansas, you started on the insurance road. Right? Yeah, After getting. After getting self. What kind of insurance

00:32:44.160 - 00:33:08.650

was it? Life insurance. Life insurance. Do you recall with what company? The Standard Life Insurance company. OK, now tell me about that. What was it like as an insurance? Well, You know, there have been so many. Incidents in my life that figured in going into the

00:33:08.650 - 00:33:30.770

various organizations and activities that they, that just, just open up. Uh, I had a friend from Austin, Texas that was up here working in the laundry. He had charge of the laundry at Western University. And one Sunday evening, He came over to visit with me, myself

00:33:30.770 - 00:33:43.339

and my wife, and he said, in the meantime, he said, well, I took out a $1000 parcel with the Metropolitan Life Insurance the other day. I said, why did you do it? I said, well, have a company, the Standard Life Insurance Company. I wasn't connected with

00:33:43.339 - 00:33:56.369

the Standard Life, but, uh, I believed in black business. And I said, why didn't you do that? I said you, you have a daughter going to Mayor Allen Seminary and she's taking commercial work. You think she's going to be able to get a job with the

00:33:56.369 - 00:34:08.899

Metropolitan Life Insurance Company? And I talked to him. He said, well, I, I, no, no, none was wrong and I just went ahead and did it. I stepped in my phone, called up the Standard Life man and told him that I'd like for him to come

00:34:09.050 - 00:34:26.469

to school the next day. I had a prospect. And I gave him that, uh, or introduced him to this prospect in first place in teaching school, uh, mathematics. I've had my class divided up. Uh, into 4 parts. I had a, a monitor for each one of

00:34:26.469 - 00:34:40.629

those sections so I could leave and they'd carry on, carry on the grade. So anyhow, I carried them to see several persons and then what school was this at that time Western University Western. And uh, so the man that was here, he was one of the

00:34:40.629 - 00:34:55.249

field men, he said, you make a good salmon. I asked him a number of questions about it, and I said, well, what do you do when you write up everybody? He said that never happens. And so, anyhow, I'd go around with them at Prospect and they

00:34:55.249 - 00:35:17.000

lined me up as a part-time salesman. Uh, this, uh, a part-time chairman, and I worked, uh, I started in 1922 as a part-time chairman, and I wrote more business than two of the men that were in the office and running the office there, so I was

00:35:17.000 - 00:35:36.429

selected as one to attend what is known as school of Agency supervision. And, uh, and, uh, with the Standard Life Insurance Company, after, yeah, Standard Life Insurance company. So I finished that and came home. And then the close of that particular year, they made me manager

00:35:36.429 - 00:35:53.020

of the office. And, uh, I was with the Standard Life Insurance Company until it was taken over by the Southeast Trust, uh, Southeastern Trust Company. Now, um, uh, Mr. Sing, now, you know, I'm not familiar with these, uh, term, and you said they took them out,

00:35:53.090 - 00:36:09.979

what, did they buy them out? What happened? Oh, OK. I don't understand. Um-hum. What happened, you said now. This other company took it over. Well, here's what happened. Uh, uh, the president of the Center of Life Insurance Cona was a Heman E. Perry, that was his

00:36:09.979 - 00:36:28.780

name. He's from Houston, Texas. He never, in, uh, so far as books were concerned. He's never been beyond the 6th grade, and yet he's one of the most skillful, um, uh, businessmen that we have. And he was very successful in building up the Standard Life Insurance

00:36:28.780 - 00:36:46.489

company. He wasn't satisfied with that. Then he organized a bank. That bank is still operating as a Citizens Trust Company, and it's not a Citizens Trust Bank, but it's in Atlanta, Georgia. However, it has, I believe, a 12-story building, office building, and they're doing, doing good

00:36:46.489 - 00:37:06.780

work there. So, uh. Uh, no, he wasn't satisfied at doing that, but he started what is known as a service company. And they sold stock, and, uh, uh, they were building drug stores, building subdivisions of land and all of that sort of thing, and just overshot

00:37:06.780 - 00:37:24.629

themselves, and they had, getting the money to do all these big things, uh, they, uh, they give, uh, Uh, it's leans on the stalk, of, of what is known as a, as a, I believe it's. I forget the name of this company that the company was

00:37:24.629 - 00:37:43.090

a holding company of the standard life insurance company. And when they gave, uh, a security, that stuff, And when they, wasn't able to meet their obligation, that, uh, Southeastern Insurance Company just took over the bank, uh, uh, no, it's the insurance company, and after they gutted

00:37:43.090 - 00:38:01.290

the company of all of its good assets, Then they dispose of that company, what was left to the National Benefit Life Insurance Company, and the National Benefit Life Insurance company, Made a great mistake in trying to take care of that, but they didn't do it, and

00:38:01.290 - 00:38:28.189

that caused them to go under. And after that, I went with the Atlanta Life Insurance Company, first as an agent, then next as a manager of the department. OK, now I see in here, uh, I'm not sure, uh, But when you were a branch manager of

00:38:28.189 - 00:38:55.030

the Kansas City office that you did some recruiting. Well, I was first. The regional supervisor. Of the National Benefit Life Insurance Company before going to the Atlanta, and I had supervision of 5 states, Missouri, Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas, and Arkansas. And I, I recruited managers for, for

00:38:55.030 - 00:39:16.459

those particular agencies, and it was a very difficult situation because it's hard to find management material. And a group of people that have been so, so slightly exposed to business, you know. And, but as I said, the, the, the, the National Bene Life Insurance, I was

00:39:16.459 - 00:39:33.689

recruiting men, uh, managers at that time. They didn't, uh, wasn't able to continue. And so I joined up with the Atlanta Life Insurance Company, first as a salesman. Um-hum. And then as a manager. Well, I just have to smile at you. I see you have Muskogee,

00:39:33.750 - 00:40:03.810

Oklahoma, and that's where I'm from. Is that so? That is where I'm from. Did you, did you, I mean, what's the name of this man, I, that was Leroy. you're on or what? Uh, now, Mr. Sewing, uh, Sewing, um, in 1929. Uh, you said that the

00:40:03.810 - 00:40:27.060

stock market crashed and about this time, well, in 31. Uh, the National Benefit Life Insurance Company had failed. Um. You talk about a, a man in your book named James H. Brown. Yeah. OK, now, was he your manager, just what, Uh, now, let me see if

00:40:27.060 - 00:40:48.419

I get myself together. Brown, of course, he, he's the chairman of the board. Um-hum. Douglas State Bank. Now, right. And I'm chairman of the executive committee. Um-hum. And the Chen Bank. And I just talked with him the day, uh, today, uh, well, yeah, uh, I met

00:40:48.419 - 00:41:14.060

Jim Brown, Uh, it must have been about, yeah, 1931 when I met Jim Brown. By somehow or another, he came by the office of the National Benefit Life Insurance Company. And, uh, I met him casually. He was 21 at that particular time. And then I was

00:41:14.060 - 00:41:30.090

going, uh, uh, up the street, uh, uh, up 7th Street, I believe, and, uh, cancer to cancer and then he came down and I shook hands with him again, and I was impressed with the way that he shook hands and he was very intelligent, you know.

00:41:31.020 - 00:41:52.290

So I began to make some investigation of him. And I started him, And Rosdell Mansfield and a little schooling, getting them ready for the national bringing them into the National Benefield Life Insurance Company. Uh, I think that was about 31. Uh, well, uh, the, the, it,

00:41:52.409 - 00:42:13.350

but not soon, no, long after that, that the National Banker stoppedriding insurance at all, so I had to let them go. And, uh, So, that was the national life insurance company. Right. So, sometime after that, I think it was 1933. I went with the National Be

00:42:13.350 - 00:42:32.689

Life Insurance Company as a, as, as, as an agent, a salesman. And uh I believe it was in the following year that I recruited Jim Brown, uh, as a, at this particular time as manager of what is known as the ordinary department, and I recruited him

00:42:32.689 - 00:42:50.250

at that time, at the same time made him assistant manager. And after, no, I was, I was fired from the Atlanta life insurance company and he would take my place. You don't have that in the book. No. Well, When I went with the life insurance company,

00:42:50.510 - 00:43:10.389

I was already. I accepted, uh, uh, a job as being in charge of special ordinary department. And they arranged to give me, in addition to the commission that I made, they arranged to give me a salary of $75. Or not. Um-hum. And I told the fellow

00:43:10.389 - 00:43:27.770

by the name of Elder who's super, supervisor of, of this new setup. Now, that was not enough. And you can't make it on that, he said, well, he, he said that the company was not familiar with the capacities of these people that had come in to

00:43:27.770 - 00:43:46.030

them, and he felt that they would do better. We'd get more when they saw that we were able to make. Well, at the first, in, in, in, in, in the end of the 1st 15 months, that was a temporary contract we had. This $75 that they

00:43:46.030 - 00:44:05.020

were, was giving me, they went ahead and counted up all that it would, uh, come to. And wanted to make my salary from then on, the salary about $60 something dollars. I wrote out my resignation and Jim, or not Jim, but the supervisor wrote to them

00:44:05.020 - 00:44:22.800

and they made it, they made a change, and they didn't do what they were supposed to do. And then after that, they, uh, they increased me. And they made certain changes in the contract some, uh, some time. But I built, The organization up to the point,

00:44:23.830 - 00:44:40.080

Well, I was making over $10,000 a year. That's way back then. Um-hum. And some of the officers of the, uh, most of the officers in the home office didn't like to see that because some of them were not making that, you see. And they made, uh,

00:44:40.389 - 00:44:58.479

some changes in my contract. I permitted, my, uh, the contract, I accepted it. And then the next year, I still owed the $10,000. Say they wanted to make a change again, I said, 00, I'll carry you to court. And so we fussed on that for quite

00:44:58.479 - 00:45:21.199

a while and finally they went through with it, and I got a lawyer. Contest what they've done and finally we settled for 13,500. They just give me that, you see. Um-hum. You see. So, uh, I, I, I, I started doing too, uh, making too much. Um-hum.

00:45:22.560 - 00:45:46.879

OK. Now, Moving along in, uh, May. Of 1934, you're in Kansas City. And, uh, you said you were persuaded to accept a manager's contract for the development of a special ordinary department. That. That's what I'm talking about. That's the same one you're talking about, right? Um-hum.

00:45:47.360 - 00:46:06.030

OK. Now, after that, What did you start doing? OK, you've gotten fired, right? Oh, yeah. OK. Yeah. What was your next step? I mean, you still got, you know, we, we, we still got to take care of that family. Oh, yeah. Well, Uh About 1934, wasn't

00:46:06.030 - 00:46:36.870

it? Right. Yeah, 19, 34. Oh, yeah. Uh, I went with the, uh, No, I'm talking about Atlanta Atlanta. Well, that 134 when, uh, that, that, that was, uh, I, I, I accepted that in 34, and that went on for 20 some years. And I, it was

00:46:36.870 - 00:47:12.560

in 9, this is 1900. 1900, let's see. Yeah. 1952 when I received the letter and, and, and my contract was canceled in 1952. Hm. OK. Now, Uh, I see a picture. We, uh, in 1940s, this is 1946, they're having a banquet at your home. Now, what

00:47:12.560 - 00:47:33.780

is the celebration all about, the banquet? What are you celebrating? I was able, uh, as a matter of fact, I started in the insurance, the general insurance business. Oh, some years back, and I had to send, uh, back and get, get my insurance cases through as

00:47:33.780 - 00:47:57.739

a broker, uh. And, uh, we were able, uh, uh, Doctor Blunt, Uh, was the first Negro that had been elected to the Kansas legislature and he when it turned down. And then next we had Bill Towers, and I, we received as, uh, through their help. An

00:47:57.739 - 00:48:22.709

agency connection with the preferred fire insurance company and in celebrating that, we, we, uh, threw a banquet that was, uh, I believe it was about 20 20th or 22nd of January, uh, 1946, and we invited quite a number of guests there, the picture of that and,

00:48:22.719 - 00:48:41.340

uh, and. And that is what that's all about. Now there's another thing. I had no idea. Of making any mention of a bank at all because that hadn't been my, on my mind. I was thinking about this general insurance business and how fortunate we were to

00:48:41.340 - 00:48:58.120

get a, a line out of ourselves or an old line legal reserve. And uh so I, um, Uh, but I did, I mean making a talk to them, the group, I said, we need a bank in this town. And we need a ban. I don't know

00:48:58.120 - 00:49:12.830

why I said it because it wasn't part of my plan, and then that that that was all. Uh. Now, I know it was, it was banks at that time, but do you have any idea how many banks, We're all operating by. About 11. All over the

00:49:12.830 - 00:49:30.399

country, only 11. We thought it was 12, but found out the bank, uh, Tuskegee was not operating. So there's only 11 all over the United States. And, and, and I'll get that pretty soon too. OK. Um, so, um, Uh, we, that was the purpose of that.

00:49:30.899 - 00:49:48.330

Now, This man, Jim Brown that you've heard about, uh, I said, Jim, I said, we're going over, uh, and I want you to go over town with me, and I'd like for you to meet a fellow by the name of Budler Desmond. Uh, at at at

00:49:48.330 - 00:50:05.580

that particular time, there's something loan and the investment company had been incorporated. And I incorporate, I, I was the founder of that company. And so all of that is in there. And so we went by to see Butler Desmond, and I made this statement to him.

00:50:05.830 - 00:50:23.290

He asked me, how is the Sentinello and investment company coming in. I said, fine, we've just, uh, put through an application to increase our stock. And uh I said, and one of these days we're going to have a bank in this town. That's the 2nd time

00:50:23.290 - 00:50:40.790

that I met him and he said, no, son, you're coming down my alley. That's what you ought to do. But and and I told him 3 to 5 years. He said 3 to 5 years is too late, you ought to do it now. And so when

00:50:40.790 - 00:50:56.699

we left that office, I said, Jim, I want you to go by the library and get the the Tuskegee yearbook and we'll read up on the banks that are operate. And we did that, we studied that, and went to Topeka. We didn't know who the, uh,

00:50:56.709 - 00:51:14.260

the, the, uh, uh, banking director was there, but we went to his office and found I looked at the board and the bulletin board, not bulletin board, but the names, you know, the. And saw where he, where he was and went there and talked with him

00:51:14.399 - 00:51:34.239

about establishing a bank. And, uh, we, as we said to him that, uh, uh, we know that, uh, there's already too many banks in Kansas City. But we also know that a large segment of the population of Kansas City doesn't have adequate banking services, and you

00:51:34.239 - 00:51:46.000

know the reason for that as well as we don't, and they just did that. And then he said, well, do you know Willard Bryant thought? I said, yes, I was co-chairman with him and his Negro College fund. He said, he's a member of this board, he

00:51:46.000 - 00:52:05.399

have a whole lot to say about it, and I suggest you talk with him. And we talked with him. That's where that started. Let me ask you this, uh, Getting, just, uh, getting, that, that's the first beginning how initially, how you just first started. I saw

00:52:05.399 - 00:52:23.939

also here where you even went to the library, you were gathering information. That's what. It was. That was when I said. You were there. Right. OK. Now. Now you will find in that connection, After we, uh, started that we were having it, I made a trip

00:52:24.239 - 00:52:38.790

covering 8 banks in the United States of America. And have you got to that? Yes, um-hum. Yeah, I made that trip. Uh, getting the information, what I call vital information, and that trip was more beneficial than anything I've got. How are you, now, did you do

00:52:38.790 - 00:52:54.550

this? Did you, were you financed by someone else? I mean, did someone help pay to you, pay, pave your way back, paying for your bus fare or your room, or you did this on your own? Yes sir. I've always been a good salesman, you see. Uh-huh.

00:52:54.800 - 00:53:12.889

And, uh, we had elected, uh, an organizing committee. Sherman Scruggs, who was one, you might have heard of that name, Matthew and some number of them, and I went to them. And I said to them, let us each one of us put up or make a

00:53:12.889 - 00:53:28.699

pool of money, and when we do sell stock, why we'll give you credit on, see, and they put up the money for me to make the trip. Well, you are right. Yeah. So, when you. And the first place that I, uh, the second place that I

00:53:28.699 - 00:53:48.270

stopped was at the office of the Atlanta Life Insurance Company to let them know what I was doing. And then I got information from all, all of these, uh, 8 banks that were very vital, very vital. And, uh, we had planned to have $125,000 total capital

00:53:48.270 - 00:54:03.110

and surplus. Uh, we were advised to get $168,750 so we changed it there. We had a man in our set up for cashier. He was in his 60s. We were told that he was too old to begin because he'd have a whole lot of study to

00:54:03.110 - 00:54:24.350

do. He was a friend of mine. What was his name? CS Matthews. And, uh, we, I contacted him, got him to, Agree not to be cashier. Well, we, those were some days that we had. When we first started, it was soliciting stuff, a subscription. We solicited

00:54:24.350 - 00:54:43.790

180,000 and when we got ready to turn it into money, most of that stuff went by the wayside. Let me, would you mind if I read a prayer that you have in your book? He, I didn't know. Now, this is during the time, uh, that you

00:54:43.790 - 00:55:04.659

had found the cashier. This, this is talking about the cashier. Um, yes. It's, um, You said you. This is after you returned to Kansas City, uh, on July 23, 1946. This is when you had a lot of valuable information from those eight banks. And it says,

00:55:04.699 - 00:55:22.219

I uttered this prayer, Lord, we find that we need a technically trained man for cashier for our team. Lord, you know him. Where can he be found? We are asking that you will guide our steps to him. And provide us with the means and power to

00:55:22.219 - 00:55:39.729

attract him to our team. In other words, Lord, you call him, and we will select whom you call. Please, Lord, let your will be done in this as it is done in heaven. I didn't know that. Yes, it is. It sure is. It sure is. And

00:55:39.729 - 00:55:59.389

then they, it's another picture, uh, where the company moved from the building to the Masonic building. Uh-huh. And it's first expansion, and they have. Different people there. But we didn't. And here you are. Yeah. Right? Yeah. That's right. Yeah, that's right. Well, we, we've got E

00:55:59.389 - 00:56:15.810

from CU. That was a young man that we got as cashier. And this was the Masonic building. this. Yeah, right down the right corner. Yeah. On the corner. Um-hum. OK. Now, let's, um,